S6, Ep 135: Derek DeYoung Returns

Marvin Cash: Hey, folks, it's Marvin Cash, the host of The Articulate Fly. On this episode, Derek DeYoung returns to the podcast.

Derek discusses his new artistic interest, wildlife photography, and shares all the details of his new gallery in Livingston, Montana.

I think you're really gonna enjoy this one. But before we get to the interview, just a couple of housekeeping items. If you like the podcast, please tell a friend and please subscribe and leave us a rating and review in the podcatcher of your choice. It really helps us out

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Now, on to our interview. 

Well, Derek, welcome back to The Articulate Fly.

Derek DeYoung: Absolutely. Thanks for having me.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. I've been watching you on Instagram and, you know, found out that you moved and that you're working on your gallery.

But, you know, before we get to that, you know, it's been about five years. I was really kind of shocked when I went back and looked at the archive since we last spoke, and I was kind of curious, I know you're always tinkering and playing with stuff, you know. Any new series or media you're playing with or any kind of artistic experiments you want to talk about? 

Derek DeYoung: Well, yeah, absolutely. Always something new. I think part of being an artist, most of us are pretty ADD, and you know, we get bored pretty easily doing the same thing every day. So, what I've been working on for the last four, four plus years is, becoming a decent wildlife photographer. There's so much more to it than I ever understood. And honestly, at this point, I have so much more respect for the guys that get out there and like, get the most amazing stuff because, you know, I grew up in the woods hunting with my dad, fishing on the water constantly. You know, that's what my whole life was about as a kid. And like, like the animal part isn't that,  I mean, I definitely have had to learn a lot. Don't, you know, I'm not trying to say I had it all figured out, but it, you know, the technical part was what was really hard for me. And Janelle has had to step in., and, I mean, gosh, to even be at all competitive, I've had to Invest. I'm probably 60 grand in just in computers and cameras and lenses. And, I mean, it is.

It's an unbelievable investment, but, I mean, it's like a rabbit hole. Once you start going down it, and you really want the results, it's like, okay, what do I have to do next to, like, get there?

And one thing after another. And at this point, it's just a very expensive hobby for me. But we've opened. We've officially opened up the gallery, and it's 50% wildlife photography.

So although, you know, I've been working as a painter since I was 23 and graduated art school, I've gone 50% of photography on this one, and I'm stoked. And it's all hung. The whole show is ready, and I feel like the photography is absolutely on par with the paintings.

So I feel really good about what I've come up with.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah, I mean, it's amazing. I mean, I've been watching your Instagram feed, and I mean, the, and it seems like also, too, you really are interested in raptors. But, you know, everything that I see in your Instagram feed, you know, it wouldn't surprise me to see it in National Geographic or Audubon, right? 

Derek DeYoung: Well, I appreciate you saying that. And that's, you know, I've got a long way to go before I even step into that arena, but I do have my own perspective, which in painting and in, in any type of art, you know, perspective is everything. How can you kind of develop what, what's your perspective? And we've been opening the gallery now for the last several days, like, all day long. And the other day, this woman walks in, even a group of women, and she says, well, I don't like fish, so what else you got?

And I'm like, I mean, I don't know what to tell you. I've just spent the last 20 some years painting fish. So, but I, my photography is not about fish. So if you like photography and, you know, the gallery is based totally on owls and bears, and you get caught,  I mean, once you open the gallery, you get called out. That's just part of it.

And, especially if it's like your namesake gallery, people are like, what's up with all the owls and bears? Can you not find any other animals? No, I see other animals, but you don't, to get pro level images and really figure it out, you do have to, like, really focus on something. And for me, that's always been the case. I don't have so much talent that I can, you know, be great at everything. I realize I gotta focus on something and really put all my time into it.

And I'd be embarrassed to tell you how much time I have into my photography, but you know, there's taking a photo of a wild animal, and then there's going there for, you know, 18 times over the course of a couple months and finally seeing him catch something or finally seeing something crazy, a beautiful light, just getting better and better at capturing that animal.

And what's weird too is like, as much as, I mean, I'm highly aware of, you know, bothering an animal by me going out and photographing it, they, like, kind of get to a point with you. I mean, I don't go all the time, and I have lots and lots of spots, so I try to alternate so I don't mess anything up.

But they get to a point where they like, I'm positive they recognize me and they're like, oh, it's that guy. He's, he’s fine. They don't like fly away. They don't, you know, like we, we all start to recognize each other and it's just kind of funny. 

But you know, the, the gig, painting fish all these years. I always have best job in the world cause research means what, being on the water, fly fishing, getting to experience all the things that, you know, all of us love and to change it up and add wildlife photography. 

I love being in the woods. I always have loved it. It's a very solitary thing for me and I've, I thank my dad like every time I'm out there for teaching me to be comfortable by myself out in the woods and just understanding, you know. You know, I was freaked out, just like anyone, like going out and wandering through the woods when I was a kid, but I did it so much that now I, that's, I have to do it, and I just love doing it. And wildlife photography brings me out there.

And the other thing is, I don't just like hike right through a patch of woods. I'm out there with like a very, you know, intricate, specific goal in mind. So I'm not just like flying through. I'm really observing and I just find it's, if I'm looking for an owl or a bear or whatever, I like really notice other things. And I really appreciate nature in a deeper sense than I ever did, you know, since I started doing this photography.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's really neat. And, you know, you're talking about goals and I know how deliberate you are, kind of, we'll just say in the fish world, you know? What did you bring kind of from a composition and design and kind of, you know, the shots that you wanted to get? What did you bring kind of from your fishing background into your wildlife photography?

Derek DeYoung: Well, good question. And it's, you know, that it would. I would have to bring those things, right, cause it's, it's kind of who I am, how I picture things. And yeah, I do share some of the same goals with my photography, you know, as I do with composing, like a painting.

It's been funny, though, with a gallery, like, I was really worried coming up to opening our doors that, like, you know, the, like, biggest fail for me would be that, that I just did this for myself. And I really didn't get, you know, to the, to the quality level with my photography that like, that I was competitive, you know what I mean? It's kind of a midlife endeavor. So, been doing the painting for a long time, and I'm pretty confident with what I'm doing and what people like.

But so far it has been, I don't know, 50-50 as far as what people are interested in, the photography versus the fish paintings. And I've been really, really happy about that. That's made me very, very happy cause there are so many, you know, it's been five years I've been working on this, and all my friends and family have been just so encouraging to have me, like, you know, launch my photography. And I'm like, I'm not there. Oh, come on, you're. No, I'm not there. Like, I'm you, I'm glad you think that. It makes me very happy, but I personally don't think I am. And until I feel that way, I'm not gonna launch my wildlife photography as far as for sale. And I don't know, you know, what do you think?

If you're already an established artist and you come out with subpar art in a different genre, you know, that's a little bit, I don't know. I was really hesitant to do that. And so I was, I wanted to make damn sure that I was ready.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's really kind of interesting, right, cause it's almost like you're running the race not against the clock, but against yourself, right?

Derek DeYoung: You know, I just would never want someone to come in and say, okay, get a little of this guy. He, you know, he thinks cause he's a great painter, not saying that I am, but he hoped, if you think I am, thank you, but. And now he expects us to buy his photography. I want it to be that my photography wins you over, you know, and is, and is good enough to do that. And I think that, until I felt like I was there, I just couldn't. I couldn't, like, push forward. So, I mean, it's been kind of a thing, like, there's a lot of people that are in my inner circle are just shaking their head, going, when are you gonna do this? Cause they know how much time and effort and money I've put into it. And I'm like, it'll, it'll happen. But I need to develop the whole, you know, portfolio and feel comfortable with it where I can stand behind it. You know, you start, you start off with hard drives full of, you know, bird butts and grizzly bear butts, because you go charging in there, and they leave, and you pull up and take a picture of them as they leave, you know what I mean? And you slowly realize, like, okay, that has no value whatsoever.

I've got to figure out how to approach this situation where I don't spook them, or how do I know they're there before they spook. And that's been the, you know, a big part of the challenge. 

And then, you know, starting to actually photograph them doing their natural thing, which, I mean, I, I just don't think that comes naturally, even to people who grew up in the woods, cause we're just used to just moving. You know, it's like, and your movement pushes birds, you know. If you just come trompsing through a forest, you're just kind of, you know, if you were seeing it from above, you would just see all the birds just part. Like a school of minnows with a tarpon swimming through it. That's just how it happens.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. I don't think people appreciate that, you know, when they see a picture on the wall, like, how many hours it took to be in the spot to take the shot, to then get the shot.

Derek DeYoung: And what's really kind of interesting about it is that I was, I don't know. I didn't know what I thought about, like, how much time it's gonna take me to get that shot. But the patience that I've had to develop has been such a gift to me, like, just being able to stop and just stand there for well over an hour waiting for something to happen. I've seen so many amazing things that never make it onto the camera, but those moments are in my head and I just, you know, I'm an absolute addict. I love being out there. I love sitting for a couple hours to see what I can see, like if there's an area I've seen animals before and no, it's really been a gift to my life first and foremost.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's fantastic too. And I don't do photography anywhere on the scale that you do, but I do have, you know, stuff, and I was kind of curious, you know, the photography nuts are gonna want to know, kind of like, you know, what are your favorite camera bodies and lenses? You want to share those with folks?

Derek DeYoung: I can, but let me just get this out of the way. I'm not a technical guy at all. And you know, I've kind of asked around and what should I get?  And I have ended at a very specific spot that I'd feel comfortable advising people, you know, on how to spend their hard earned money cause I've wasted a ton of money.

And the, the kit that I would recommend if, if you're out there and you're wanting to like step it up to a pro-level kit, would be to go ahead and get the Sony a1. I'm sure they've got like the new a1 or whatever version, but I've got the older one, and I bought it used off a website online.

And the 1-400 G Master, that's the one. I bought the 2-6. It's super heavy. Way harder to, like, hike or be on my bike. I do a lot of photography off my bike. And what I found, too, is like that extra focal length or extra zoom, you know, as much as you think right away, oh, I need to zoom in. You'd be better off sneaking in on that animal a little bit more.

And even if you blow some chances at 1-400, it's just a little bit better quality lens. And so your results at the end of the day, once you get the right thing, you know, the right situation, you'll have a million shots. You know, it takes 30 shots a second. So I advise you to go with the shorter zoom and get the 1-400.

Before that I shot Canon, and I always liked it and some of my friends shoot Nikon. I don't think you  could go wrong right now cause everybody's super highly competitive. But that's what I use is the Sony a1.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's interesting too, because looking at like the photos that you post on Instagram, I mean to your point, like the, to be able to see the fibers and the feathers and those like really like, I think you've, I'm thinking of a picture. I believe it's a barred owl and it's just phenomenal, just the detail and the feathers.

Derek DeYoung: Well, and two, I, I will rent lenses. There's lenses that cost 13,000 bucks and trust me, I'd love to just drop in and buy one, but it's just not responsible when I just bought a gallery.

So, I rent them for a week and every single day I get up before light and go out for a couple hours and have dinner and then take off and do the last hour and a half of light and until dark, It's like, I, you know, it's like 70 bucks a day to have that lens. and you gotta do it for a week. But it's like, the results are amazing. It truly is that much better than, than the lenses that I own. So that's another thing I'll do.

Marvin Cash: Interesting. And so should folks expect to see kind of in the coming years some of your photography, you know, kind of like you've done with your art, you're gonna find it in kind of different products and different collaborations or is it just gonna be, you know, standalone, you know, prints and originals in the gallery?

Derek DeYoung: I haven't, you know, thought about that or that's not something I'm wanting to seek out. You know, I don't know what's gonna happen with the photography.

Nothing needs to happen for it still to be like an amazing way to spend my time. You know what I mean? And that's the most important thing and I, I love to share it with people and I've, for years, you know, back when I was kind of still developing it, I was so frustrated with my results. I  knew the animals, I knew the woods, and I was comfortable with that.

I wasn't very good with the cameras and the computer and that was, you know, it's kind of need that to get a good photo. And so, you know, you, you just gotta figure it out, you know, and I bought the wrong lenses, never rented them and borrowed them. And you know, just very little nuances are what it's all about as far as getting the really crisp, like pro-level stuff, especially with flying birds.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's interesting cause, I mean I'm, I'm a little bit older than you. So like I remember like when I was a kid and had like my first Canon camera, you know, you would, you were shooting film, right? And you'd take the pictures and you know, I didn't have a dark room, so you know, when I took slide slides cause it was cheaper, right? And you know, you take the pictures and you didn't know. And it's like it was always amazing. I think when, I think it might have been when my second son was born, I got my first digital SLR, and I was just blown away at how quickly you could progress cause you just didn't care. You go shoot a car full of stuff and come home and delete 95% of it, right.

Derek DeYoug: It is crazy. Yeah, just like the trial and error. You can look and see your mistakes quick. But you know, although I am a little bit younger than you, I, I minored in photography in art school, and to that point it was all film in darkroom. It wasn't until I got out of art school and started as a painter that I bought my first digital, and I mean, at that point, everyone was like, the fad's gonna pass. It's not, it's not sticking with us. And I had spent a bunch of money on a Canon film camera because I was like, no way, I can't.

Like in my mind, at that point, I couldn't fathom how you could digitalize the process of taking a photo cause I understood the way the mechanics of the camera and the film worked, and I just couldn't imagine that a digital version could even compete. But I was wrong.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, we've got a terrific camera shop here in Charlotte that is still that kind of mecca. But yeah, I mean, I, you know, at this point, I don't know, I think you'd have to like bark at the moon and rub your tummy three times to be able to give them a roll of film to process. 

Derek DeYoung: They will. I mean, I think it's come back in a big way, you know, the whole film thing. But like you say, it's when you're used to just having immediate gratification, and I mean the prints that I've got at the gallery, I mean, it's one thing to take photos and just, you know, shoot for as good of, of a photo and just close to perfection as you can on a big Mac screen, but when you actually get a 60-inch print on the wall, that's when you're like, okay, I know like the feeling of that photo really comes through, and is it a little over or underexposed or what's the feeling of the colors and it, you know, and now, now that I've been doing that for a while in printing, when I'm out, you know, on a photo shoot, I'm thinking about, oh, like, I need more light. I need to, like, you know, get a little bit more light here.

Or I'm thinking about the photos that I have printed and they do make me a little bit better or they at least make me make a little different choices.

Marvin Cash: Interesting. And, you know, before we shift gears to the gallery, you know, obviously, you know, you spend a lot of time on the water. Do you have any fishing adventures you want to share with our listeners?

Derek DeYoung: Well, I, my last fishing adventure was up to the Naknek River Lodge or River Camp, excuse me. They'll probably shoot me for that. And that was an awesome adventure. 

Have you been to Alaska?

Marvin Cash: I have not, but it's kind of. It's on my list. I've got some other places I really want to go. My bucket list trip is Mongolia. But, you know, I definitely want to get to Alaska before I shuffle off my mortal coil. So.

Derek DeYoung:  So this was my fourth trip to Alaska, all of them have been fishing trips. And I will say, you know, I think people kind of think about the, like, oh, it's not what it was, or, you know, you can say that about anything. But, and that may be true. I'm not trying to say that there the fish counts haven't gone down, but it's still so significantly better than any other place I've ever fished, and I've been around the world. You gotta go, you gotta go do Alaska. It's like a. you go in, you get a certain distance from Alaska and you're en route,. Every dude has camo and fly rods and, you know, you’re walking through the airports and people are like, oh, where are you going? Well, yeah, this is my sixth trip and I wanna catch this. And I'm hoping, I mean, it's just then you get to Anchorage and everyone's going from there to, you know, out to the area they're gonna fish. And it's, it's cool. It just is. It's like nothing else. And you got, you gotta go and experience it and just be a part of it.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah. And is there any kind of particular species or time of the season that you like to be out there?

Derek DeYoung: You know, I've tried some different parts of the summer and fall, but I’ve done the Kenai Peninsula and fished the Kenai, all different parts of that for silvers and rainbows and Dollies. And then I've done three trips to Bristol Bay, two to the Sportsman's Lodge on the Kvichak. And then this last one was to the Naknek. And I got my, I had a, I had a few goals. Do you do that when you travel, make goals that you try to fulfill?

Marvin Cash: Yeah, I do. It's, it's part of my charm, as people say.

Derek DeYoung:  So my goals, in like I brought my buddy, who hilariously is also named Derek and everyone gets a kick out of that. There was no purpose in that. It just happened.

But anyway, he's never been to Alaska, but we tied flies for the trip and you know, talked about a lot what we wanna do. And he's like all into the swinging flies part, which as soon as you make up your mind, just like, oh, I can't wait for that. Well, guess what?

The swinging flies doesn't really start until the salmon stop dropping eggs because the eggs are just the easy, best protein source. When we got there, they were still dropping eggs, so the swinging didn't really kick in.

So we had, you know, spent a ton of time getting ready and practicing like our spey casting and tying swung fly type of patterns and, but that's how it works. So then you move on to the next thing.

And I really wanted to get a 30-plus-inch rainbow, and so that now we're using like, you know, the pegged beads, which, you know, whatever. I'd rather catch it on a swung fly, but this is what's happening, so that's what I'm doing.

And I think our, oh, by fourth day we did spend two days swinging flies. Didn't catch a thing. So now I'm like, put that away. Give me the, give me the bead. I'm. I'm gonna try to get something done.

And we caught quite a few smaller or medium sized rainbows. And about the fourth day, Derek had a 37-inch rainbow to the net. And I'm not Derek, not me, the other Derek. And I mean it was the biggest rainbow I've ever seen. And it just blew out of the net and snapped the line and we were all like bummed, you know, unconsolable.

And like two drifts later, as luck would have it, I hooked a big one, got it up and it was 32 inches. Nowhere near as big as his, but still my biggest. And so I, I got that goal. So that was exciting.

Marvin Cash: Neat. And I know you're partial to the salt as well. Any saltwater adventures?

Derek DeYoung: Well, this will be my first year in 12 years that I'm not going down to the Keys for, we usually go for five months, and sold my saltwater flats boat. After all, all that time using a 1999 Hewes Redfisher.  I had a custom carbon fiber Kevlar poling skiff made and I, you know, I just, I didn't have the whole move to Montana and gallery thing totally in mind. And about the time I took possession of it, this whole thing started. And so I sold it about a year and a half into owning it.

And so we're not gonna be down in the Keys, and we're gonna take a little time off of the saltwater thing. But my next trip is down to Patagonia. So, we did that last winter and absolutely loved it. And so we're gonna go back this winter for almost a month.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's a very, very neat place. It's been a while since I've been. But yeah, it's. iIt's kind of like, you know, you literally just kind of turn the world upside down and it's like the same latitude as Montana and the people are great and the food is awesome, you know?

Derek DeYoung: Yep, you got it. You must have went to the same place I did because that's exactly how it was. And yeah, your, your fishing skills actually, you know, work there.

Whereas when you go, you know, all my buddies from, you know, trouty areas come to the Keys, and it doesn't really transfer that well to that environment. You know, the trout skills don't. But yeah, no, it's fun to go down and, and just, you know, it's, it's a lot easier fishing there. I'll, I'll be honest. You gotta work hard, but it's, you know, you'll, if you can, if you can fly fish for trout in the US, you're gonna do well there.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah, I think the biggest thing is being able to, you know, be comfortable dealing with the wind because it's just as windy down there as it is in Montana.

Derek DeYoung:  Oh, yeah, maybe more so. But it can be really windy in the Keys, too, so you do get used to, you know, clicking over, you know, almost down to the shore and really ripping a cast and knowing it's gonna land 12 feet into the river.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah, it's interesting. I haven't done a ton of saltwater fishing. I think the last, gosh, it's been probably, so let's see, my youngest son is 16. It was before he was born, and we were down in Andros fishing for bonefish. It's just, well, that's actually not true. I've done some redfishing trips.

Derek DeYoung: I love bonefish. I mean, you don't have to get a more prestigious, you know, permit or tarpon. Bonefish are so much fun cause if you go to the right place, it's a target-rich environment and you know, you get to actually get pretty good at it.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's a, yeah, it's a totally different game, you know, and it's kind of interesting too cause, cause I didn't, you know, I learned about kind of the move from Michigan back to Montana, I guess Montana 2.0 just by watching your Instagram feed.

But you know, tell us a little bit about kind of, you know, how that all came about to, you know, leave where you grew up and to go back to Montana and open a gallery.

Derek DeYoung:  You know, we moved in 2015 from Montana back to Michigan and we bought a little cabin right on Lake Michigan. And we got just totally focused on that and learning all the fishing around there. The fishing was great, by the way. Everybody just assumes that it was a huge downgrade in fishing. It wasn't. We had world-class smallmouth and carp, lake trout. I mean, there was so much to get into in Michigan, but right on the shore, right in front of my house. And as years went by, it did get discovered and you know, became more busy.

But, I mean, for, for the first like six years, there was no one there ever. And I mean, we caught fish up to six-and-a-half-pound smallmouth on the fly right out in front of the house.

I mean, there's not that many places you can do that. And I was really lucky that I bought that cabin. I had no idea if the fishing was good in front of that cabin or not. I just got super lucky.

But about three years after we moved over there, I hadn't gone back to Montana, and I just all of a sudden felt, like, really depressed about that. And my wife's like, well, no problem. Let's go back for a month in the fall. That was a time period that we had a little bit of leeway on our schedule.

So we started coming back to Livingston and just renting a VRBO and fishing and hanging out for a month. Maybe I do one or two paintings, but mostly I'd just be on the river every day, which was awesome. 

And just, over, we did that for, I don't know, six years. And I every time I came back to Montana, I just started to make a plan on how to get back here as my permanent location.

And that's nothing against Michigan. It's just, I love being in the mountains. It just speaks to my soul. And I love being on the lake, but it's just not quite, I'm just not that guy. 

And so we had been renting a Vrbo right on Main street in Livingston, and we both really liked it. And we started looking at real estate right on Main Street, and started kind of visualizing what would it be like to buy a building and start a gallery. And so, you know, started, started there. And then we started actually looking and found a place that might work, and so just kind of fell into place.

Marvin Cash: Very, very neat. Tell us a little bit about just kind of the layout of the space.

Derek DeYoung:  Well, it was the old pawn shop, and it was in need of a lot of work, and it was not like a bargain. You know, it's just the market these days. It's like, okay, this is a really awful building. It's gonna take a ton of work to get it up to, you know, what we need and should be a bargain, but wasn't. And we, we made a few offers at it that reflected where we thought it was worth, and the guy told us to get lost.

And it was probably, I don't know, four months later before we actually made another offer and made a deal. And from maybe the next week on, which was, this was all like real early 2024, I think, yeah, yeah, like January, February maybe.

And they started just ripping stuff out of it, like the next day after we closed on it. So, I mean, it was all year to, you know, totally tear it down and rebuild it, but it looks absolutely amazing now.

It's just got just enough of the original 1890s building left, but everything else is new and just really complimentary to the old school look of it. And yeah, I'm stoked. I never would have pictured that it would turn out this good.

Marvin Cash:  Interesting. And so is it gallery and studio space or is your studio somewhere else?

Derek DeYoung: I've got a studio at home, too, but my main studio is in the back of the gallery. It's not like in the gallery space itself.

Marvin Cash:  Got it. And I would imagine you probably, did you have to modify the space to get the light that you wanted in there.

Derek DeYoung: Well, we rebuilt the whole front of the building to be just more welcoming and better for a gallery. And then, yeah, track lighting everywhere. It's amazing how bright it looks when you put track lighting everywhere.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And I'm trying to remember, have you had a gallery like this before, or is this kind of the first kind of iteration of your gallery life?

Derek DeYoung: I kind of accidentally put a gallery into my house when we lived in Montana. It was maybe, maybe about 2,000 square foot, new house with an unfinished basement. And I put my studio down there, and people started calling and wanting to come see what work I had available. So I put, like, one wall, and all I did was, like, put some gray carpet up and put a one track light, and people would buy artwork up. I honestly had no faith at that would, you know, sell art and, but people started buying artwork off it.

And the next thing you know, my wife has a guy coming out to put wood floors in and drywall and electric lighting. And I'm like, whoa, this is really happening. We were really, like, going to town putting this gallery in.

It started as, like, just one room, and, by the time we sold the house, I wonder what the new owner has done with it cause the whole basement was a gallery. So it was not just, like, open to the public. You had to call and make an appointment.

But a lot of times guys would come in in groups, and they would just make an appointment when they came into Livingston to, you know, go out to dinner, go to the bar. They'd start off at my gallery for a couple hours because, lo and behold, I had a bar in the gallery.

And anyway, we had some great times, and we moved some art from there. But it was good for me as far as what I do now with this new gallery, cause, you know, I learned about all the hanging systems and just the way the lights needed to be. And so that was a good education.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah. And so, you know, was there any, you know, what was like, the biggest challenge or surprise building out this new space?

Derek DeYoung: It was really hard just to be patient because it took till October 1st. And just the way it worked, we were not allowed to even, like, you know, the general contractor held the key. So was that even, like, my property?

And so we moved out here, sold a lot of stuff, gave a lot of stuff to family, really tried to whittle down our possessions, but, rented a house in Bozeman. And, you know, we didn't have a place to live. Like, we didn't own a place. We were going to, probably the biggest challenge, now that I think of it, was that we were going to build off the back of the building. There's plenty of space behind this building that you could build. We had drawings, an architect, whole thing, And when push came to shove and they like submitted the drawings to the township, the quote went up by like 80%. And we just didn't have the money to do it.

And it was not a big house that we were gonna build, but they needed to do like, any new builds in the commercial district needed, you know, 2-hour firewalls, sprinkler systems, all these things that like really made it a lot more expensive. And so we kind of called that off. We looked at a few houses and we ended up buying a building that was four doors down from the gallery. So, it was already retrofitted as a home and worked perfect for us. So it all worked out the way it was supposed to, but for a couple minutes there it was like, what are we gonna do? Where are we gonna live?

Cause we really did, did not want to like, you know, live outside of town and have to commute in, like starting a gallery. We just, one of the biggest components is just being there and being open.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, interesting. And so, you know, I know you've opened it. I would imagine that's probably a soft opening. Are you having a grand opening maybe like later this month or in November?

Derek DeYoung: Yep. We're doing the ribbon cutting ceremony which, you know, I say that I have no idea what's actually gonna happen there.That's the Chamber of Commerce has come to me and so this is what's happening. When do you want to do it? And so we're gonna do it during the Art Stroll or the holiday Art Stroll, which is November 22nd and it's a Friday.

I'm really looking forward to it cause this really is a culmination of so much planning and work, and it'll be a special day.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, that's neat. So that'll be, I guess the Friday before Thanksgiving.

Derek DeYoung: Yep. Yep.

Marvin Cash: Very cool. Well, you know, I also know kind of from our previous conversation that, you know, you're always collaborating with brands,  and I was kind of wondering, have you put that on hold or do you have some collaborations that you're working on you wanna share with our listeners?

Derek DeYoung: It's not on hold necessarily. It's not the main, you know, thing that I'm choosing to do these days, but I'm always happy to work with, with other brands and companies to make cool products.

I mean  it's funny cause, you know, we've worked really hard to develop a good portfolio of products, and maybe people have given me too much credit because they come to me with all these products that they think I need to do, you know, and it's like, I can't just develop, you know, there's an extent which I can, if a company offers something really close to what I want and it's quality enough, that's something I can do.

But I can't just develop, like all these random products from scratch that takes so much time and is such a, you know, maybe a big company like Patagonia or Skwala or Simms, they can do that stuff. It's just funny what people think, like, yeah, you should make this.

Well, I, you know, if I made it, it would, I'd have to put all my time into marketing it and trying to get it into stores. Like, that would cost so much money to make.

But no, we've been setting up our merchandise wall at the gallery and that's been kind of cool too, cause we haven't just taken the, you know, formula of like, this is what a gallery is, and tried to do that. We've, you know, we've grown up in fly shops. We've been doing business with fly shops forever.

And I guess we're a little bit more comfortable with that kind of atmosphere than just a straight gallery. So, yes, it's a gallery, but it also has, you know, stickers, shirts, glassware. I mean, all the coolest stuff that I make is a part of it.

And then, of course, the photography. And then, you know, we offer all the different types of prints that I offer of my artwork, we offer at the gallery. It's not just fine art, and it's not just like, only come in here if you are looking to add an original to your collection. Like, I want everybody to come in. I want everyone to feel welcome.

And, you know, a guy said to me the other day, he came in, and I could tell his energy was a little off and he was like, uncomfortable, I could tell, and he was like, oh, I'm. I'm just here browsing right now. I'll come back, probably buy something. I just want to.

And I said, man, I hope you just can relax and just look at the art and know that I don't expect anything of you. Like, art is to be looked at and enjoyed and, you know, thought about.

And if there comes a time when you want to buy a painting from me, I would love that. But by no means do I expect that. You know, that's what this gallery is about, is, you know, exposing people to my artwork.

And hopefully, you know, hopefully people can come in and feel comfortable and enjoy it and not feel like that weird pressure that, you know, they're expected to buy something.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. It's interesting too, right? Because, you know, there's the like, oh, you see it and you buy it and you may never even go to a gallery, but, you know, to have that relationship with you. Right?  And that connection makes whatever they purchase in the gallery all that more special. Right?

Derek DeYoung: Maybe, if I have a good connection with them. But, I mean, the point is. Is what, you know. There was like a group of teenagers that came in and they were totally stoked and, you know, maybe they weren't quite prepared to buy their first original painting. I'm just kidding. Obviously they were not, but we just gave them some stickers and I mean, it was still a special thing.

And, you know, 10 years from now, they're gonna be running shit and they'll come buying from me. That's pretty cool.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so I would imagine you probably, you know, you've got your grand opening in November, but, you know, have you kind of thought about kind of events or kind of programming, particularly, I guess, during kind of high-tourist season that you might have in the gallery?

Derek DeYoung:  We don't have any major plans, but we'll, we'll probably do probably three shows a year and actually, you know, do like a show night. And I mean, I'm a huge music lover.I love playing the guitar. I'm not good at it, but I love doing it. And I paint guitars and I've got guitars in the gallery and I'd love to have, like, music at the events.

And playing the guitar in the gallery just sounds amazing cause it's kind of a little bit echoey with the brick walls and the wood floors and so that, you know, definitely music will be a part of it and, yeah, it'll be fun. I'm really stoked. And I, you know, just like any trip I go on, the number one thing that I think about is not fish, but people. And the people in Montana I love, you know, they're great people. So, that's what draws me back here. Number one.

Marvin Cash: Yeah, it's definitely one of my favorite places on the planet. I haven't been back as much maybe in the last four years as I like to, but, yeah, it's just, it's amazing. It's kind of funny. I've got friends who are over in Ennis fishing the Madison, and, like, I get to tell them the bars and where to go and where to camp and all that kind of stuff, and it's, it's super cool, roght, yeah. And they send you pictures…

Derek DeYoung: For the most part, Just stays the same.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And they just send you pictures like we're at the Gravel Bars. Like you need to have a cold smoke and you know, tell people to eat breakfast at the pharmacy cause that's the best place. And, you know, not to be afraid of eating at the bistro, at the bowling alley, all that kind of good stuff.

Derek DeYoung: I just learned a couple of the, what was it? The, I don't remember if it was still called the Grizzly, but, you know, right by Ennis Lake. Right. I think that burnt to the ground. I was just there. My buddy said it burned.

Marvin Cash: Interesting. Yeah, it's, it's kind of funny. I mean, I've started, like I, when I first started going to Montana, gosh. I mean, I'm gonna feel really old, like probably close to 20 years ago. I used to stay in town in Bozeman and walk around and that was kind of a cool thing. And you know, as Bozeman has gotten busier, I've kind of, I moved to West Yellowstone and then West Yellowstone got so popular that it was impossible to get good lodging, you know, at a decent rate. Like, I thought it was kind of crazy to have to spend $300 for a hotel room in late September. October. 

Derek DeYoung: Yeah

Marvin Cash: And so I started staying down in Ennis. And you know, the great thing was I could drive up the valley every morning and miss all the kind of nuttiness getting into the park. And so, you know, that was kind of how my love affair with the Firehole started.

Derek DeYoung: What was your favorite time to fish the Firehole?

Marvin Cash: I like to fish it like, you know, probably maybe not quite this late. I mean, the weather's changing, but literally, I like to go kind of middle to late September kind of as West Yellowstone is winding down. They're getting ready to kind of close up and take that like two-month break to get snow for the snowmobilers and to be out there and to fish, you know, when it's snowing, right? And..dude, it's nuts.

Derek DeYoung: Were there still hatches happening?

Marvin Cash: Oh, for sure. You had the, you had the Miller Caddis and the Blue Wings, right? And so you’d go out there and I like to fish it above the falls, and  one of my favorite places to go was like, if you pulled in at the Nez Perce picnic area, you could walk and then cross the river and like, you wouldn't see a soul.

Derek DeYoung: Yeah, there's always, always those little secret things like that where you can really get away from the crowds, and that's cool. You're not gonna find a similar place to fish. It's very, very interesting and just beautiful.And did you ever end up in the middle of a herd of bison?

Marvin Cash: No, but I did have one time I was actually fishing close to the road, and my back, let's see if I was swinging, I guess my back was facing upstream. And these. you know, every now and again, people would pull over to take your picture, right? But this woman pulled over and she rolled down her window. She's like, are you gonna be okay?

And I literally turned around, and there were probably eight bison crossing the river that I could have literally poked with my fly rod. And I was oblivious cause I was just in the zone, you know, swinging soft tackles.

Derek DeYoung:  Oh, man. Bet y'all never forget that. I was on, I was up more towards the north part of the park, and I was fishing by myself.I'd hiked in quite a ways, and I heard something coming through the brush, and I, you know, I'm in the water, so I don't hear it real loud until it was right there. And I turned and look, and cow elk breaks through the bush. I mean, immediately behind me. And I couldn't even see her body, just her, her neck and head. And she just like, kind of sat there and watched me fish. Just kind of going, what what are you. Is she gonna get a drink and, but, you know, it's so cool to be right in there amongst the animals.

Marvin Cash:  Yeah. You know, when you were talking about kind of that magic hour of light at the end of the day, what I would usually try to do is, you know, save that time and get off the water, because, you know, as it's getting cold, you know, it's, that cold air is pushing, you know, the bison together and the elk down. And, you know, you just have these amazing things that you can kind of sit and watch, you know, in the last little bit of sunlight and then, you know, drive into West Yellowstone and have dinner and go home.

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. Yeah. There's definitely some magic in Yellowstone Park.

Marvin Cash: Yeah. And so, you know, you've been pretty busy, but I would be remiss if I didn't ask you, Derek, if you have any other projects you're working on or contemplating you want to share with our listeners?

Derek DeYoung: Well, I've got several canvases on the easels that I'm working on, and I'm definitely got some really cool fish art that I'm working on, brown trout. But I'm also working on some owl paintings based, you know, from the inspiration from some of the photos that I've taken and just some of the things I've seen that I couldn't photograph. So those are coming along as well.

Marvin Cash:  Very neat. And so if folks want to, you know, follow your adventures, you know, at the easel, I guess now behind the camera, in the field and on the water, where should they go?

Derek DeYoung: Definitely Instagram, Facebook are, you know, I don't know if everyone does that anymore, but that's where I've posted stuff and that comes through in my, you know, on my homepage and my website, too. So if you're not, like, doing that, you can definitely go to derekdeyoung.com and you'll see, you know, all the latest things that I posted.

Marvin Cash: Very neat. And I'll drop all that stuff in the show notes.

Derek DeYoung: Perfect.

Marvin Cash: Awesome. Well, Derek, I. I'll let you hop this evening and get another glass of wine. I appreciate you spending some time with me. It's been a lot of fun. We have to get together again and not let it be five years next time, right?

Derek DeYoung: That sounds great. I appreciate you reaching out to me, too.

Marvin Cash: Oh, it's been neat. Well, listen, take care.

Derek DeYoung: Yep. Thank you so much. You too.

Marvin Cash: Well, folks, we hope you enjoyed the interview as much as we enjoyed bringing it to you. Don't forget to check out TroutRoutes Pro at maps.troutroutes.com Use ArtFly 20, a-r-t-f-l-y-two-zero, all one word to get 20% off of your membership.

Tight lines, everybody.