S7, Ep 41: Navigating High Water: Strategies for Success with Mac Brown

Hey folks, it's Marvin Cash, the host of the Articulate Fly. We're back with another casting angles with Mac Brown. Mac, how are you?

I'm doing great. How are you doing, Marvin?

As always. Just trying to stay out of trouble and heard you were hammering away on Noah's Ark before I started calling.

Yeah, we've had, we've had our sheriff some, some storms here for sure the past, the past few weeks it seems. And yeah, the water's pretty big, big right now. So I thought, well, that might be a good topic.You know, a lot of people that are already on vacation or visiting here and it's like that and they think, well, they need to do something else. But there's a lot of times you can, you can make magic if, if it's not too blown up. And I figured that'd be a good thing.How do people make that call?

Yeah.So I guess, you know, the first thing you and I were talking before we started recording is, you know, if you've got to get out and we'll talk about safety and stuff like that later. That probably means, for example, that you need to head high in the water table up into the park.

That's a good place. Yeah. The higher up you get, you know, you're going to have a lot less volume because of the catchment.You know, up high is not going to be near as big and you don't even have to get in the water is the other thing. A lot of places up high you can, you can fish from the bank without every stepping foot.If it's, if it's pretty big water and there's a whole lot of ways to have, have success. It's just about knowing where to go and what to do.And I think that's, that's a big part I see is definitely there's no float trips going on the last few days here because the water's it's pretty big and it's chocolate. I mean the visibility is not even 2 inches looking in the water.So when you got 2 inch visibility of chocolate, then it's probably best to look somewhere else.

Yeah.And so you know, the great thing too about, you know, fishing high up in the, up in the water table, like up in the park, is that that's going to also be the first water to clear.

That's right, yeah. And the freestones coming out of the park will also be the first to clear.Compared to the bigger waters that go through farmland, like where I am, like in the Tuckaseegee drainage, even Nanahala, there's a lot of houses from the upper Nantahala. And you know, when it gets big, it gets a lot of chocolate color even on the upper.So depends how much agriculture and developments took, you know, taking place. Because you really don't see the park turn real chocolate very often. I mean, just because there's no development where it comes off.Like the watersheds on Hazel Creek and Forney and, you know, Deep Creek, all these park streams on the Carolina side, there's. There's really no reason for it to be real chocolate colored. I mean, you can see it flooded and still be relatively clear.So they're not going to be near as much turbidity of soil mixed in, you know.

Yeah.And so, you know, if we talk about kind of coming back down to like the tuck, for example, you know, we were talking about a good rule of thumb, as you know, you probably want, I don't know, about a foot of visibility. Right. Or you probably should go rent movies or something like that.

That's right, yeah.I mean, when it's a foot of visibility, you can do pretty well, which is another reason, not just for safety reasons, but you're not going to do as well out in the middle anyway. The fish are conditioned.Even if they're, even if they're hatchery fish, the wild fish definitely are going to be out right on the edges and keep moving out. As the river comes up higher, they're going to be on the edges no matter how high it gets. It's just like the floods from Helene.You know, a lot of people thought the fisheries in the Nochucky where I grew up in Greenville, they thought all that would be devastated. And I talked to a lot of the biologists that went over there and studied it.There were several of them from Carolina side that helped over there with some studies. And to their surprise, and it really doesn't surprise me.Fish, no, even in that kind of condition, I mean, the nochucky was larger than it's ever, you know, been recorded. And they still had plenty of muskie.It's a big muskie river through the gorge there, you know, above Irwin, a lot of smallmouth down near Greenville, Tennessee, a whole lot of different species of fish. But they, they said they didn't even notice a huge decline after the flood.So that tells you all those fish knew exactly what to do going out on the edges. So I don't really worry about that. That happens here all the time where people think all the fish are washed away.And I just don't think that's how it works. You got to realize fish are super adapted, adapting when that takes place to know what to go do, you know?

Yeah. And so, you know, they get pushed to the edge, they get pushed on structure.And then, you know, we kind of talk about, you know, probably, you know, with, with turbid water, you know, you kind of want to get down quickly. You know, you probably want color and, or flash right to, to fish. You know, in that situation, I guess if it's safe.I think about like jigging things like mop flies, you know, woolly boogers.

Good tactic. Yeah. Those are all good things.And a funny thing is about this is, you know, one of the funniest moments for me personally of all the years being around this as an educator is during one of the schools years ago we had a school and it was a huge flood in March and we were out and everybody was like, their faces were low. You know, they're looking at the water thinking it's going to be a wasted, wasted trip. And as far as learning how to. We were doing nymphing that day.And I can remember you, I said, you know, put something light colored. Like I, I had a white mop in my vest and it was really simple. We were in carhartts that day.We didn't even have waiters because it wasn't raining anymore. So we're standing up on the edge and I tell everybody about this tree. It's like 20ft away. And I said, you know, there's a perfect spot.There'll be a brown trout there. And everybody's thinking that I'm just talking making this up the first four spots. And I said, there'll be something there.Bow and arrow cast in there. One jig boom. 17 inch brown trout, first cast. I mean, we're talking chocolate color, just like we were describing.The water's way up, it's in the trees, off on the edges. And then people are rushing and scrambling through their gear and they're all excited because they just saw four fish get pulled out. I mean, you can.If you know what to do in those conditions, you can still make magic happen.It's just really, a lot of it is people try to go in and fish their regular technique when it's flooded and then wonder why it's not good because they're fishing the wrong places usually. You know, man, it's real predictable.

Yeah. And I would say too, right.You know, probably a good idea to leave the indicator in your shirt pocket and, and tight line because you Know, there's just, there's just too much velocity on the surface to make indicator fishing effective.

Yeah, I think, I think just going straight, straight, tight line and you know, jig. And I like to jig a lot when it's flooded like that.Well, I like to jig when it's clear too, but I like to jig especially when it's flooded like that. And worms. A lot of different worm patterns out there that we like to use in high water events and those are always a winner.That doesn't matter if you hear the White river system or out in Colorado. I mean, the worms are going to excel any, any fishery in the world when it's hot water and flooded.You know, that's just one of the main go to things. That's when worms are at their best, I think.

Yeah. And you know too, if we talk about safety, you know, a couple things I would say, you know, the water gets pretty pushy when it's fast. Right.So I would say, you know, if it's, you know, more than a foot above your knee, you might want to be thoughtful about it. And I would say certainly don't leave the waiting staff in the truck.

Or you can do like me and just wear car hearts and never even get. I don't get in the water at all when it's flooded.I mean, when it's flooded here I just, I really enjoy just wearing like my just work pants, you know, and just staying out because there's. You can still reach a whole lot of things by just staying out. And you kind of circle in and out, in and out to the stream and it's just easier.It's actually a lot easier and it's actually a lot better for safety wise just to stay out of the water entirely when it's that big. Like right now I wouldn't want to be in the water even on deep creek that I live on. It's like we looked at that this morning and it's just.There's so much water coming down through there. You just kind of have.And of course it helps knowing, knowing a creek, like knowing where you are, it makes it a little tougher if you've never been on the creek to find out where do I go when it's flooded. You're gonna have to do a lot more searching than somebody that already knows if you walk, you know what I'm saying?Like I, I kind of already understand when this creek floods exactly where I'm gonna walk to, to fish. You know, that's an advantage yeah.

And I would say too, that, you know, you know, if you do decide to get in the water, you know, wade slowly, you know, ideally you'd have a partner with you. But then I think the really important thing is people get in a hurry and they don't keep two points of contact. Right.Which is going to be one foot in your waiting staff before you start moving around and you'll get in trouble. And then the other thing too is you got to remember that the current's pushing you downstream, even if you, you know, don't slip and fall.And so you better make sure that as you're working your way across to wherever you want to be, you can actually get back somewhere that you can get out of the water.

That's right. Yeah, that's. That's good advice.And of course, in a boat, like, if it's real flooded, probably don't have any business floating, you know, like, we didn't see any boats today. I mean, I drove up, up to Franklin today, so we saw probably 22 miles of river. And of course there's nobody out when it's that high.I mean, there's no boats going down at all because I'm sure the commercial trips were all, all canceled or doing something else. Another, another game plan. But another good option is the tail waters up here that are, you know, below the dams.I mean, we have, we got Calderwood Lake, Chioa Lake, there's all kinds of, you know, Wolf Lake, Tennessee Lake. All those lakes will produce really well in days like today. I mean, they're still fishing well, the lakes and I mean they're lake impoundments.But it's not like dirty water like a Cheolo be running totally clear even though it rained a bunch the last few weeks, just because the catchment, it's got plenty of room to clean it out in the lake above in Fontana, of course. So if you like being in a boat during these water events, that's another good option that you could do.Still, if you had a client that you had to keep them in a boat because it's. So they're not going to be real into walking in somewhere far. There's still that option on the table.

Well, I think, I think we've kind of touched all the bases. Mack Brown, what do you think?

I think that'll help. Help people a lot, make that decision anyway.

Yeah. And so, you know, we've got, you know, three weeks left before DH Burns off, and then it'll be kind of a park only game or a park mostly game. Right.If I remember correctly, you don't have any school scheduled until the fall. But if folks want to learn more about the kind of the fall class offerings or book a day on the water with you, where should they go?

Yeah, the dates are all listed on the website. Macbrownflyfish.com underneath specialty schools they'll see all the different dates for what's coming up in the fall.There's mainly the first one will be the casting two day casting event there in September and then we'll have the wet fly clinic down in Mountain Home, Arkansas. And then we have several schools here in October and November as well.That'll be the that'll be probably the best place to find all that in the menu item up there under specialty classes.

Well, there you go. Well folks as always say you owe yourself to get out there and catch a few tight lines everybody. Tight lines, Mac, Tight lines.

Marvin.