S7, Ep 75: From Kitchen Table to Riverbank: The Whuff Rod Co. Journey with Dave Huff

EPISODE SUMMARY

Guest: Dave Huff - Founder at Whuff Rod Co. (Kentucky)

In this episode: Industrial designer Dave Huff shares his journey from kitchen table rod building to creating affordable, performance-focused fly rods with soul. Topics include musky fishing strategies, organic business growth and challenging traditional fly rod pricing models.

Key fishing techniques covered:

• Mid-flex rod design for better feel and timing
• Musky fly fishing with heavy streamers
• Roll casting techniques for beginners
• Farm pond fishing with fly rods
• Davidson River trout tactics

Location focus: Kentucky, Kentucky River system, Davidson River (North Carolina), Northern Kentucky waters

Target species: Musky, trout, panfish

Equipment discussed: Whuff Rod Co. rods (3wt-12wt), Fuji Alkanite guides, mid-flex tapers, extra tips, $65 warranty policy

Key questions answered:

• How to build affordable performance fly rods
• Why mid-flex rods offer better feel than fast action
• How to grow a fly rod business organically
• What makes musky fly fishing challenging

Best for: Intermediate anglers interested in affordable fly rod options, musky fishing strategies and small business insights

Marvin Cash00:00:00

Hey folks, it's Marvin Cash, the host of The Articulate Fly. On this episode, I'm joined by Dave Huff, the driving force behind Whuff Rod Co and the Kentucky River Musky Classic. Dave shares his passion for chasing muskie on the fly and what drove him to make Whuff Rod Co a reality.I think you're really going to enjoy this one, but before we get to the interview, just a couple of housekeeping items. If you like the podcast, please tell a friend and please subscribe and leave us a rating and review in the podcatcher of your choice.It really helps us out. And a shout out to our newest game changer patron, Michael Bryan. Thanks for your support. And remember folks, we host our community on Patreon.Check out the link in the show notes to learn more about all the great benefits like discounts on tying materials and guide trips and much more. And finally, a shout out to our sponsor. Trout Routes.We all know streams are getting crowded, and chances are you're not the only one at your local access point. Get away from the crowds and busy gravel lots by using TroutRoutes Pro.With over 350,000 access points mapped across 50,000 trout streams and much more, Trout Routes has all the data you need to help you find angling opportunities that others will overlook. Up your game and download the app today. Use code ArtFly20.ArtFly20 all one word for 20% off of your Trout Routes Pro membership at maps.troutroutes.com now on to our interview. Well, Dave, welcome to the Articulate Fly.

Dave Huff00:01:32

Yeah, thanks for having me.

Marvin Cash00:01:33

Yeah, I'm looking forward to our conversation. And we have a tradition on the Articulate Fly. We like to ask all of our guests to share their earliest fishing memory.

Dave Huff00:01:41

Okay. Yeah, Farm pond fishing for me, man. My, you know, I grew up in Kentucky, rural Boone county area and fishing with my grandpa.Probably, probably the, the single moment that sticks out the most is, you know, I was maybe six or seven and I remember casting out a Rapala or something and hooking two fish on the same lure and bringing them in. And I remember that pretty vividly is after that I was like, I was all about fishing. You know, like I want to, you know, lunch break at the farm.I was fishing after work. I was fishing, just trying to, you know, chase stuff. And I was notoriously like late for, for dinner with my, with my buddies.You know, my mom would be like, you know, we'd be, we'd walk down a creek and before you realize that you're, you're two miles down the creek and realize you have to be back for dinner and, you know, a half hour and you're not going to make it, you know, kind of stuff. So, yeah, whatever kind of outdoor adventures I could get into, I always tried to tie into, you know, try to tie in fish into that stuff.

Marvin Cash00:03:03

Yeah. Very, very neat. So when did you come to the dark side of fly fishing?

Dave Huff00:03:08

I tried it. At one point. I had a relative from, like, Texas that had a fly rod or something that he brought up on, like, a family trip. And I noted. I saw it. I.And I. I mean, I tried it a couple times, and I feel like I had. I don't remember the year necessarily, but I definitely know, like, in my younger years, you know, middle school age is.You know, I've tried it a few more times and didn't really pick it back up until after college. And it was one of those things where it just kind of set the. The rod just kind of sat in the corner, you know, it was cool.And then other stuff got cool.I grew up racing dirt bikes and got into cars and then college, and, you know, I. I picked it back up later in life on a trip down to Brevard and fishing the Davidson River. That kind of like, re. Ignited fly fishing for me. And then from there, it was kind of. It was kind of on, you know, still.I still do some spin fishing from time to time, but I'm about a 90 percenter when it comes to fly fishing.

Marvin Cash00:04:31

Yeah, it's pretty neat. The Davidson is probably my favorite river to fish in North Carolina.

Dave Huff00:04:36

Yeah. Yeah. I was. It was on a kind of a whim. A buddy of mine was down there. We were on a trip, and, you know, we were kind of.We have been talking about fly fishing, and we had new fly fishing setups that we were.We were trying to plan this big boundary water trip, and we were gonna try to go up there and, you know, live out of canoes for three, three to four weeks and take some fly rods with us.And we went down there one year just on vacation, and we're kind of like, man, we should just book a guide trip so we could kind of take a crash course and, like, learning all this, because it's like. I was like. It's way different from when I did it. Did I come up and we met. We met up with a guide. Guide down there by the name of Jeb.And I remember we showed up. We showed up and look like noobs, probably.And, you know, we get out in the water, and the first thing he Said to me, to us is said, this ain't a river runs through it, and woolly buggers ain't, you know, he's like, we're not. You're not going to be waving these things around in the air all day trying to make false casts. He's like, I'm going to show you how to roll cast.I'm going to show you how to catch some fish. You. And I kind of. I kind of looked at my buddy. I'm like, this guy's my kind of people, you know? So, yeah, from then it was. It was kind of on. We.My buddy hooked into.Immediately hooked into a huge brown trout that the guide kind of opened his eyes when he saw it jump out of the water and realized it was a big one, you know, and we caught a bunch more fish that day. And, yeah, rest is history.Now it's just a challenge of getting out of as many days as I can and trying to learn as many different, you know, styles of fishing that you can. So.

Marvin Cash00:06:29

Yeah, I bet that was Jeb hall from Davidson River Outfitters, wasn't it?

Dave Huff00:06:32

Oh, yeah. He's a bad man.

Marvin Cash00:06:34

Yeah, I've. So I've known those guys forever, and I have a tradition with my boys.I take them fishing during the Christmas holidays, and Jeb was our guide on one of those trips because I always know that it's better for him to work with the kids so I don't lose my patience when they were younger and yell at them and ruin the day.

Dave Huff00:06:52

So. Yep, yep. Yeah, he's got a lot of patience, and he's just a really fishy dude. So.

Marvin Cash00:07:00

Yeah, absolutely. Jeb is. Jeb is a great guy. All the guys at DRO Are awesome and, you know, so you kind of come back to it a little bit later on in your life, you know?Who are some of the folks that have mentored you as you've gotten kind of deeper into the sport.

Dave Huff00:07:13

Man, Mostly. Mostly guys from the fly fishing club up here. The Northern Kentucky fly fishers. They're just. There's so much knowledge there. It's an.It's an aging club, you know, Mike Arnold is one of the oldest members of the club, and he's actually the one that taught me how to. How to build fly rods. And he's still there. He's still active with the club. He still teaches rod building. And I just kind of. I'm one of those dudes.Like, my wife knows when we go on vacation, she's probably gonna. I'm gonna disappear for a Couple hours and she can always probably find me at the, the old bait shop talking to the old crusty, salty dudes.Like she just knows that she's gonna lose me for a couple hours to those dudes. You know, I just love hearing stories and love learning and those, those guys are just a wealth of knowledge.And yeah, they're probably some of my, as far as fly fishing goes, like some of my biggest mentors came from the NKFF for sure. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:08:28

It's interesting. I know Mike Arnold from my time is the president of the Southeastern council of fff.And yeah, yeah, he's a great guy and he was always, he know, always doing tons of stuff with the council. I haven't seen him in a long time because the, you know, the, the council wasn't as active as it has been and it's kind of coming back.But yeah, he's a great, great person to learn from for sure.

Dave Huff00:08:51

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:08:53

And so kind of funny, right? So, you know, Wolf Rod Company is almost 10 years old. You know, you, you kind of get into fly fishing.Like, you know, what makes you crazy enough to want to start a rod company?

Dave Huff00:09:04

I mean, in the early days I was doing custom rods. So I started doing custom rods in 2016 and I just basically, I really enjoyed the process.You know, my background in design, you know, creating things has always been something that I, I love to do. I mean, even in my full time job, I build mountain bike trails and hiking trails for a living.So we're just creating things in nature and forests and trying to make things out of dirt that look like they've been there for 10 years, you know, so, so yeah, I mean, started doing custom rods. It got to a point where with the full time job, I just couldn't really.I hated the fact that I had to tell people, like, hey, it might be, you know, four, five months before I can get your rod done. You know, that was like that for me.That was like the turning point from where it went from like Dave building rods on his kitchen table or in the basement in his garage, whatever, to like trying to figure out like, maybe this needs to be something else.And then the icing on the cake for me for the actual birth of Wolf Rodco was I was like, I started fly fishing for Muskie, you know, 10 years ago or something and I just didn't enjoy the rods. I, they weren't, you know, I, I tried, I tried a few and they just like some.I didn't know what I didn't like, but I Knew I didn't like them, you know, and that's when I kind of went to the drawing board. And now, you know, I was super active in my club, the, you know, the. The local club. And we were getting a ton of, like, new members every month.Like, we were getting like 10 or 12 new members showing up to the fly club, and then they weren't coming back. So, like, between. There's like, a little culmination of, you know, not.Not loving the fly rods that I had access to, seeing people that were really passionate about fly fishing not come back to the meetings. And I just kind of. My brain is so focused on, like, the better mousetrap, so to speak.You know, I. I kind of put my head down and realized, like, most of the people were going to our local shop, they were trying on waiters, they were doing all the stuff that. That they were taught to do, you know, to get set up.And then they'd go to the rods and they'd put a Thomas and Thomas in front of them, and they'd be like, holy crap, you know, like. Like, I'm going to be spending, like, $2,000 to go fly fishing. And then, you know, it was kind of like they just. I'm fine with just spin fishing.You know, they didn't know another way. Um, so it was a little bit of rod performance. I wanted something that wasn't, you know, necessarily super popular at that time. Um, and then price.I wanted to be able to provide a rod that had really good quality at an affordable cost so that people could actually get out and enjoy fishing and not be stressed about saving money to buy a fly rod.

Marvin Cash00:12:39

Yeah, got it. And so, you know, tell me a little bit.You know, you were saying there was something specifically you didn't like in the musky sticks you were fishing. So tell me, like, how that translated into the style and feel of the wolf rodco rides.

Dave Huff00:12:53

I just. They.They were really stiff and didn't handle musky flies well, you know, and at that time, I didn't know why, because I didn't know enough about fly rod design. I just knew I didn't like it. And when I don't like something, I try to figure out how to make it work.You know, I can work with anything, but I know, I know what I want and I know what I don't like, you know, And I think part of it is the long time frame from when I learned how to fly fish to where I picked it back up to where, you know, I just remember as a Kid and you know, being younger, how much feeling and like soul a flyer I'd had, like, that was the thing I loved about it is you could feel the fish, you could feel the cast when you caught a fish, you could feel the fight. And these new, these, these fly rods I was using for muskie, you know, they're looking at it now.They were just essentially rebranded saltwater rods that weren't made to throw wet socks, you know, at, at tree stumps. They just, they were made for throwing little flies through wind. They had a lot of tip feel and that was about it.And that's just not what I, you know, I, I went back to the drawing board and wanted to really, I wanted to provide a, a really mid flex heavy rod that you could cast day in and day out for an entire four day trip and not wear yourself out. And it would be built like a tank and affordable.And that's the Riverwolf, one of our rods, the 11 weight, that was the first rod that I actually developed was an 11 weight, which is probably not something most flop companies start with, but that's where I went. So.

Marvin Cash00:14:53

Yeah, it's interesting too because I think having a little bit more feel in the rod certainly helps from a timing perspective.And you know, because you feel the rod better and it makes it, I think, you know, fishing a rod with a little bit more sole actually makes it more pleasant because you don't have to sit there and watch what's happening because you can feel what's happening.

Dave Huff00:15:11

Yep, yep.

Marvin Cash00:15:13

So, you know, you have a background in industrial design. Tell me a little bit about how that kind of works its way kind of into your, your ride designs and your, your manufacturing process.

Dave Huff00:15:24

I mean for the most part I, I probably did things really backwards from like what a traditional fly rod company would do. I just ordering blanks, figuring out the ones that I really liked, figuring out like learning about tapers and learning about mandrels.And I, I designed the first few ones in my rods.I designed them out of feel like reverse engineering them essentially off of like blanks that I would just order from a catalog, you know, until I found the ones that I liked, you know, and then from there, you know, doing some measurements, figuring out what, what I liked about them and what they, what made them, you know, react the way they did.Not having that background fly fishing wise, but having the industrial design background to kind of know like how to take something apart and dissect it and really like figure it out. That's what, that's kind of where the influence part comes in is, you know, obviously like people, people know us from our colors.Our colors are definitely stand out against the crowd. And that was another thing.The industrial design side of me was like, like, if I'm going to come out here and I'm going to come out swinging against all these big companies, I, I got to not look like all those big companies.You know, if I come out with the, you know, a standard green rod with black wraps or a black rod with gray wraps, like I'm going to get lost in the crowd real quick, you know. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:16:59

Plus it helps, you know, when people bump into people fishing your rods on the water and they're like, well, what's that kind of lime green rod? Who made that?

Dave Huff00:17:05

Right? Yep, absolutely. I mean, and it's great.Like we've been a major supporter of like the Beast of the east tournament for the last four years or five years now.And it's cool being on the water in a tournament setting and seeing a bunch of our like blue 12 weights with bright orange wraps standing up in a rod tube, like going, you know, flying down the river, you know, you can see them right away. Yeah. And it's just, it's just, it's, it's been cool. I mean, I've had a lot of really great feedback.People like, really like the rods, you know, and even at trade shows and stuff, you surprisingly had a good amount of older folks that voice their opinions positively that they're like, man, these things look so great.Sometimes those other rods, Rods just got really boring, you know, And I'm like, dude, coming from like a 78 year old dude, that's kind of, that's pretty cool, you know. So, yeah, absolutely.

Marvin Cash00:18:11

And I would, I wonder too. So I was kind of curious.So have you found people making blanks that you like or have you gotten to designing tapers that you like and you have people making the blanks for you?

Dave Huff00:18:22

So I, I, I have a factory overseas.They have, they have their own full R and D facility and I basically utilize their R D facility to produce me tapers that I, that I want in the beginning. It might like the, the 11 weight. I think I built 10 or 11 rods before. I was like, this is the one.I've used the same shop from day one when I went, when I decided to go factory built. I still build all the originals and I've got a really good working relationship with them.I can at this point, I can kind of tell them what tweaks I want to make and they'll send me a blank to test. And you know, the last two or three, man, they, they nail them, dude, straight out of the gate. That like I.Our communication's so good after 5 years been dealing with the same person in the company and it's been great. They own all the mandrels. And that's just a cost thing for me right now. Like, it's not super important for me to own the mandrel.It's more important for me to have access to a full R D facility that can tweak, you know, tapers and do things that I want because I don't have the ability to. To build my own, you know, facility like that yet. So they do, they do all that. I do all the specs and then I'll blueprint. I'll. I'll blueprint a rod.Once I get it where I want it, I'll spec the taper that they. That's the. Whatever the final revision is.I'll spec that and then I'll spec everything down to thread wrap color, you know, spacing guides, cork grade, you know, rating grain, grain window, the whole deal and then do all the artwork for them. And it's a, it's a cool process. I enjoy it. I really do enjoy it.You know, the first few rods that I developed were I really, you know, the 5 weight, the 7 weight and our 11 weight, they have like that more mid flex feel. Really got a ton of soul to them and just kind of take you back to your roots cast kind of feeling.But then, you know, I've got some other rods that have a little bit more action to them and a little wider, a little faster, you know, so there's a little bit of everything that every one of our rods isn't built on the same taper or blank material. So very neat.

Marvin Cash00:21:17

And so, you know, it's kind of interesting hearing you talk about having stuff made overseas. How are you dealing with the tariff stuff right now?

Dave Huff00:21:24

So far so good. I know some companies are having a little harder time than we are. It's the, the biggest hurdle for us has been freight costs.The freight companies are really dinging you. Their freight costs have doubled over what they were, which, you know, is unfortunate.I think they're trying to take advantage of a situation more than. I mean, the costs haven't gone up that much for them. It's just. They see a chink in the armor and they go for the throw. Right. So. So.

Marvin Cash00:21:59

Well, let's, let's hope that that gets better. And the terror Stuff doesn't cause you any, any lost sleep, right?

Dave Huff00:22:06

Yeah, man, I'm, I'm gonna, you know, we had a few questions about that this year at the trade shows and things. And I just kind of told them, you know, like, we know our numbers. We're gonna try to hold steadfast as far and long as we can to our current pricing.And, you know, if we got to make changes, we do.But for now, we're, you know, my wife and I are, are the entire company and we're both, we're both comfortable with where we're at and we want to try to. I'd rather get more hand, more rods out in people's hands fishing than pad my pockets more. So.

Marvin Cash00:22:46

Yeah.And so, you know, kind of help us, help me kind of, you know, help our listeners kind of understand what differentiates your rods, you know, in the sense of, you know, you're at a great price point. How do you compare to like the super high price points in terms of performance and warranties and things like that?And then similarly to kind of come down, you know, I think one of the things that like, for example, TFO really did in the fly rod business is based basically made everyone start to make, you know, for lack of a better word, like an entry, mid level and high level rod. You know, how do you kind of compare to, you know, other kind of, you know, entry level rods from other manufacturers?

Dave Huff00:23:23

Yeah, I mean, you know, the beauty, the beauty of it is we're so new that our biggest hurdle is getting our name in front of people. Our rods perform very, very well.And most people that test cast one of our rods at a trade show, their, their immediate response is this rod tests or this rod casts as good as X, Y or Z, you know, which are typically all four to five hundred dollar rods, you know, and then the other thing is like, I can't believe it's. I can't believe this. You're selling these rods for this much, you know, and we've got about a 75% conversion rate at trade shows.If we're at a trade show that has a, has a casting lane and the availability for people to pick a rod up and go cast it, about 75% of those people come back and buy a rod. So I think that we're doing the right thing. We've grown organically. I've been a super big proponent from day one.I don't, I don't believe in flash in the pan marketing. I want to grow organically and slowly. Word of mouth is you know, word of mouth is still king no matter what.You know, we, we don't buy, we don't buy likes, we don't buy followers and we, you know, we put our money where our mouth is. And I think, you know, from a rod's perspective, you know, a lot of our, a lot of our 250, $250 plus rods are built on Fuji Alkanite guides.Really good modulus blanks. You know, the, the componentry is there. You can see it and feel it.Another cool thing for us, you know, from a sales perspective, everything, everything six weight and above comes with an extra tip in the, in the rod tube.Part of my reasoning for that is just because I've been on trips before where I did something stupid and broke a tip and it just ruined my trip because I was just bombed, you know, so having an extra one there, you know, it, it's not, it's not a huge thing, but it's something, it's, it's a nod to let people know like, hey man, like I grew up, you know, I grew up fishing and traveling and fishing and I'm trying, we're trying to think through all those little details. You know, another really big thing that we do that a lot of companies don't do, we do not replace sections of a rod.I just don't, don't agree with it. I've never had a good experience with trying to get one section replaced on a rod. The rod just has never felt the same ever again.So if one of our customers breaks a rod, there is a replacement fee, 65 plus shipping.And you know, if it's on their side, if they smash it in a car door or something, $65 plus shipping, they're getting a brand new fly rod shipped to their door.So, and if it's something on our end, you know, a guy, they have a guide failure or something happens that we can identify as a quality issue, then we ship them a brand new rod on our dime. So I think that's something that's kind of unheard of in the industry. Most people don't know that's our policy just because we're so small still.But it's just another thing that we do to try to get people back out fishing quickly and not have ongoing problems with a rod that they have, you know, three sections that are two years old and then one section that's brand new.It's just, it's a philosophy that we're going to stick with and you know, it's Obviously not the best financial model, but we're, we're willing to put our money where our mouth is and we want people to be happy with our product and get back out to fishing. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:27:52

It's funny you say that. We should have a few beers sometime and talk about organic, Organic growth.Cause I think that's, I actually think it's a superpower in this day and age. And I think the more and more we see technology, I think it's going to be more and more important for, for real companies to grow their businesses.

Dave Huff00:28:10

Yeah, I, I mean, I think that a man's word is always going to be valuable, you know, and organic growth is a lot like that. Organic growth to me is kind of like a man's handshake. Right.So it's not something, you know, if, if you stand behind it and you stand behind your product and you do what you say you're going to do. And I, I think it's. Yeah.I mean, in this world of AI and all this other stuff, like, people can create fake things, but if you're a human doing good things and being a good person and creating a good brand and sticking behind it, like, they can't take that away from you. So.

Marvin Cash00:28:56

Yeah, and I've never understood this whole game of buying followers. Like, I just, it just makes no.

Dave Huff00:29:01

Sense to me, man.When you start putting a dollar figure to it, that's what, that's, that's how they make it make sense, you know, that's where it went wrong, you know, so every 10,000 followers you get is a dollar amount and that's, that's when things kind of go, go askew a little bit.

Marvin Cash00:29:22

Yeah, it's interesting.So, like, in my world, you know, you know, I, I don't believe in buying the listeners and the followers because when you go to sell advertising, you want to sell people real engagement. Right.It's also too, like, I, you know, I don't know how you feel about promotions and things like that, but I'm very promotion averse unless it's got a really good kind of reason behind it. Because I think, you know, my, my feeling is people understand what free means.And you're not really testing anything other than people that are looking for, you know, free tires, basically.

Dave Huff00:29:57

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, we're, we're kind of similar to that. I mean, we, we get people, you know, do you, do you have a pro staff?And, you know, I kind of always tell them like, like everyone's, you know, like our, our rod prices are pretty affordable. And you know, when you buy a rod, you become a member of the wolf pack, and the wolf packs are pro staff.You know, like, we've got, we've got folks in Canada and in America here in the North America, too. Like, they bought one rod, and within a year, they own every rod we make, you know, and like, they paid full price for all of them.And like, when we went to Canada for the Toronto Sportsman show this year, two customers that I met at a fly fishing Muskie tournament in 2019, they took, they took days off to come work the booth with us. Like, just surprised me. Like, they didn't, you know, they're like, oh, if.I just thought they meant, like, they were going to come hang out or, like, see us.Like, they're like, no, we took the, we took the days off to come help you work the booth, you know, like taking people over to the casting lane to, like, teach them how to cast and fly, you know, like work with kids and things. Because they just knew, like, we were going to be inundated with people. I think, like 70,000 people came through that show in four days.So, like, that's something you can't buy.

Marvin Cash00:31:26

Yeah, I would say, too. I mean, it's, it's the, the real power of it is, you know, plenty of people will fish and wear stuff that people give them for free.

Dave Huff00:31:34

Yep. Right.

Marvin Cash00:31:36

And so, you know, kind of to that point, like, I'm a big believer. Like, I just tell people, like, this is what I spend my money on.

Dave Huff00:31:42

Right.

Marvin Cash00:31:43

And I think that's a very, very powerful brand testimony.

Dave Huff00:31:47

Yeah, I think so, too. I mean, and, you know, we have started trying to mess with the, the guide side of things to try to get our name out there more.But, you know, I grew, I grew up racing motorcycles and bicycles, too, and I've run teams and done the team manager thing.And one of the pet peeves for me as a team manager was always like, you know, you had your bike sponsor and the first thing you did at the beginning of the year was you got your discounts and everyone ordered all their parts, you know, so you, you, you got, you know, whatever, 50, 65% off for all your stuff to get.To get all your stuff ready to build your bike to go for the racing, you know, and then it was crickets, you know, the whole deal was here, you guys are going to be on this team, you're going to get your jerseys, you're going to get all your parts, and then you're going to race all season, and you're going to do all these things on social media and promote the, you know, promote the companies that support us.And then once they got their stuff, it was like they forgot all that, you know, and you can't take it all back because they did pay for it, you know, to some degree. And that was my worry with the whole pro deal, like guide ambassador thing was like, like, how do you, how do you patrol that?You know, we're going up, we're going up against these huge companies that, you know, you might get a new guide that wants to get a good deal on some rods, but the first chance they get, or the first sniff they get by G. Loomis or one of these big companies to get some support, like the first thing they do is drop us, you know, because, because Orvis or G. Loomis is way cooler. Right. So it's, it's a hard thing to police. So we just kind of done that organically too, you know.And I've just met people along the way and kind of let them ask me what they want, what they need.Most of them want to support us because they like us as humans and they think the rods cast well and they're not under any kind of obligation through a shop to run a certain brand in their boat, you know, so we're, we're still playing with it.We've got a couple different tiers of guide ambassadorship, you know, so if, if people, if guides are out there and they want to get some of our product in their boats, we usually test the waters with a smaller discount, see if they're gonna do what they say they're gonna do, and then they can work their way up into a bigger discount as a guide. Because it is important when people are out catching fish, they look down and see what they're fishing usually.And if, you know, we could get some brand recognition out of that, it's important. So very, very neat.

Marvin Cash00:34:47

And so why don't you, Dave, walk us through. I think you've got what, about a half a dozen specific rod rides? You want to walk us through those?

Dave Huff00:34:55

Yeah. So we, we run, we have everything from a 10 foot 3 weight up to a 9 foot 12 weight. So we've got our high stick, which is our 10 foot 3 weight.Great entry level price at 179. A really, I mean it's a, it's a fun casting rod. You know, whether you're Kentucky farm ponding for pan fish out of a canoe. Uh, tons of guys do that.Just, they just use that extra one foot of length to roll cast their cast out there while they're sitting down. It's an effortless cast and rod.Great, great, great option for someone that wants to not just have a, a ten foot three weight that is solely just built for euro nymphing. You know, like it casts well, it roll casts well. It's not, it doesn't have a, a down locking reel seat on it. I did that for a reason.I wanted to, I left a little bit of room in the quiver to, to develop a more euro specific rod down the road as we grew. And then we've our 9 foot 5 weight, the roll caster. It's going to be more of a medium, medium action rod.A lot of people compare it to like the Reddington classic trout, like that kind of a feeling rod. So lot, lot more forgiveness, a little bit more soul roll cast beautifully.The beauty of that rod, when I was developing it, I really wanted a rod that was light in hand but like a beginner could pick up and put a loop together and not feel like they're fighting the rod the whole time. And it, it's cool watching people pick that rod up for the first time.Even like casting instructors, they'll pick it up and they'll, they'll, they'll try to cast at like a super fast dry fly rod or something and they'll slow down their cast and get it and then they'll just be, they'll weld it. You know, it's like they can immediately adjust to that rod and get it working the way it needs to. And then you pick up.A beginner will pick it up and go out there and they immediately have confidence, you know, so, so that's our nine foot five weight. We have got a nine foot six weight with a fighting butt called the Fish Whistle.That's going to be our first rod that has more of a salt inspired taper, A little wider modulus, a little more tip action so it's a little lighter, a little faster. That rod was originally designed for fishing dock light fishing for juvenile tarpon and snook down in Florida for a guide buddy of mine.And once I got done with it, I just really enjoyed casting it. I was like, you know man, I need to add this one to the lineup. So nine foot six weight Fish whistle.Then our nine foot seven is the streamer stick that is going to be going back to more of the traditional mid flex feeling rod. Super fun to cast.You know, all of our rods are kind of named something a little different and based off of their kind of indicative of, you know, what their qualities are. So that one's 179 price point for that one because of the componentries, you know, a little bit more in line with the five weight stuff.The, the next rod that we have is the eight foot bomber is our graphite eight weight. The nine foot nine foot eight weight bomber. That one is built on a similar taper to our six weight. So a little lighter, a little faster. Salt. Salt.Inspired Fuji alkaline guides. Spare tip. Yeah, lot, lot of fun for your snook, red fish, sea trout, things like that.And we have another 8 weight is a 8 foot 8 weight power glass which is a fiberglass rod. Super fun carp rod. It's got a lot of power. Started that rod out as a nine footer and didn't like it, but then got it down.Once we got it down to the eight foot range, it was punching through some wind. I did a lot of testing down in Texas for that red fishing and it just turned into a really fun rod.I, I kind of, I knew I wanted to add at least one fiberglass rod in the lineup and it was, I didn't want to do a three weight or anything real light because there's a ton of people doing them. And I was just kind of, I was kind of sold on the eight weight because of its versatility.I feel like you can take that thing, you can take that thing to a little creek and catch some pan fish and it's still fun or you could really, you know, go catch some bigger fish and it's forgiving enough to, to, you know, you know, I've got customers that have caught 30 inch, you know, pike and muskie on it up north. So it's got a good range.As for a glass rod and then going back to the graphite stuff, We've got a 9 foot 9 weight strip set which also built on that faster taper like the 6 and the 8.And then we've got our river Wolf which is our 9 foot 11 muskie stick that comes in two colors like a gold metallic and orange or an OD green matte and black. And that's going to have that, that medium deep flex for casting big, bigger, heavier flies.And just a rod that's really comfortable to cast like day in and day out for like four days at a time, you know. And then we've got our 9 foot 12 weight which is the double hall, which is a little bit lighter and a little bit faster than our 11.A lot of people use it for musky but it's a great rod to go take to the salt. If you're, if you're a dude that primarily fishes freshwater and you want to do a couple tarpon trips a year or whatever. One a year.It's, it's a great option for that and for you know, Amber Jackson, bigger fish and assault. So yeah, that's, that's our current lineup and we're working on some other stuff too. So. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:41:48

Can you share tease any details of the other stuff?

Dave Huff00:41:52

Yeah. So been working on a shorter rod. Working on a. A seven foot probably.I was kind of up in the air between a 771 and a 73 trying to figure out what I want. I think it's going to end up being a 7 foot 2 weight called the pocket knife. And that's, that's just come out of.We've had a lot of requests for a shorter rod especially in the Appalachians and the brook trout guys. So going to try to create something. It's, it's, it's in process and just trying to refine it a little bit and get it.Most of our rods go through about a year of testing and just prototyping before, before they land on the website for the general public. And then the other really cool exciting thing I'm working on, I'm working on our first lineup of mid priced rods.Gonna be called the Destination series. Gonna built. Be built with a little bit higher end. Components haven't landed on the exact guides yet.They're either gonna be like sea guides or, or recoil guides. It's the jury's still out on that. I'm testing both.There's some pros and cons to both of them but the modulus is gonna be a little lighter, a little faster. The reel seat's gonna be nicer, the cork's gonna be nicer. Price point for it. We're shooting for like a $459 price point for the Destination series.And it's going to be the first series that we are going to offer in different sizes. So you'll be able to, you'll, you'll be able to go on the website and order anything from a 7 up through like a 12 or a 14 weight.So up until now our rods have all been just whatever that model is is. It's, that's, that's that color and that's the size. So this will be the first like step into our like mid priced range. And I've also kind of.My goal is to be able to create a price point around the $459 range with a lot of performance. And ultimately what I want to do is be able to.I want people to be able to go on our website and buy a three pack of rods for what the cost of like one heliognose cost. So people are trying to go on a trip to, you know, Belize. They want to knock out the slam.They can go, you know, I'm working on some packaging designs so that they could, you know, buy an 8, 10 12, 3 pack that comes in a case. They can just buy all that for 1200 bucks, jump on a plane and be set, take some reels with them, you know.So that's kind of one of the more exciting projects I've been working on. And I've got a lot of hours in on the 12 weight that I've been testing. And everyone that's casted it's really loved it.So I'm excited to get those out there.

Marvin Cash00:45:00

Yeah. So when should folks expect to see those on the website?

Dave Huff00:45:03

Man, I don't have a. I don't have an exact data on it yet. It's a big ask from us financially to, to, to get that inventory in. That's the biggest hurdle for us right now.The, the rod development is farther ahead than, you know, we just gotta be careful. Most of em, it's kind of easy. Cause we can bring in, you know, a couple hundred of a nine weight or something.But when you're bringing in a couple hundred of seven, seven through 12, like you're talking a pretty big chunk. So we're just trying to see, you know, test the waters.We're working on some other marketing stuff to try to get in a few more shops and things like that and really get some samples in people's hands so that we kind of have a little bit more product moving across the country versus just in the eastern side where we're at now, and make us feel a little bit more comfortable about making that last push, you know. So yeah, I got it.

Marvin Cash00:46:05

Cause it'll, it'll probably more than double your inventory to, to make that purchase, right?

Dave Huff00:46:10

Yeah, yeah, for sure. And honestly, we were kind of, you know, kind of waiting to see what the tariff thing did too.You know, you don't want to go drop or order for 1400 rods or you know, 2000 rods right away.And we, we got a decent shipment of rods in to refill some inventory that we were sold out on a few models, you know, about a month and a half ago and pleasantly Surprised that the tariffs didn't really affect us as bad. So kind of refocused and, like, all right, well, maybe we can make this happen.So the biggest thing for me is, like, just making sure the testing's exactly the way we want it. So I'm going to get some final samples back from the R D facility and hopefully be able to show some of those off during show season.And what I'd really like to do is push some orders through show season so they can, you know, show up in March or April and hit the shelves. So, yeah, absolutely.

Marvin Cash00:47:12

You know, folks may not know that you are also the founder of the Kentucky River Muskie Classic, and just kind of curious, you know, when did you get the fever to chase muskie on the fly?

Dave Huff00:47:22

Oh, man, like, 2015. I think I started 2015 late, like, that fall, and then it's kind of just. Yeah, it's been 10 years now.So I'm, you know, I think for me, it's a heritage thing. They're native to Kentucky. I just got really interested.Anything that's super challenging and is, like, something that most people just would think is dumb and pointless, those are the things that I get attached to somehow. And musky fishing was one of those things. You know, it was a challenge. It was, you know, you get your highs and your lows.And once I started catching a few fish, floating some beautiful rivers in. In my home state and learned about all the history of those rivers with the Indians and, you know, the hunting and the.The backstories of all these, you know, these rivers and creeks, it just, you know, it kind of stuck with me. And then the community behind it, too, was just so. So cool. And. Yeah, just. Yeah. Just was kind of drawn to it.And I've met a lot of awesome folks along the way because of the musky fishing thing. I mean, I would say, if anything, it's. It's been one of the harder hurdles for us to. To. To cover or. Or get away from.Like, if all I had to do was sell musky rods, I'd be fine.Um, just trying to let people know we saw other odds, you know, So I was so heavily focused in the muskie community from the beginning, just trying to get our name out there to the world, you know? Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:49:16

Very neat. So tell us a little bit more about the event.

Dave Huff00:49:20

Yeah. So last weekend In February started two years ago, we had 21 teams, I believe the first year. The second year, we had 40 teams.Two teams didn't show, so we ended up with 38 total. Teams and 112 anglers. So huge, huge growth. And within the first year, the. This second year, we had 38 teams, 112 anglers, and 38 fish got boated.So really, really good outcome for the tournament.Most folks didn't even think we were going to be able to put the tournament on because three weeks before the tournament, we had like, historic, like, catastrophic flooding that affected southern Kentucky.And a lot of the waters that we were fishing, even during the tournament, about 2/3 of the fishable water was just not fishable because the rivers were just getting blown out because all the reservoirs above them were just full. So the dams were just wide open, you know, so to have that good of a turnout, everyone had a blast. Everyone was catching fish and seeing fish.You know, it was cool to see.And we're going to continue to grow it every year and just make it better and try to raise as much money for the Muskies Inc. Chapter, chapter 52, the Daniel Boone Chapter. We're, you know, it's. It was an idea, and we're trying to figure out ways to help them raise some more money. And the growth of the.The growth of the tournament has actually got us a seat at the table with some of the fisheries biologists and people that we actually need to be talking with to make some changes because we've had some really bad stocking years. You know, Covid didn't help, and then it kind of just snowballed from there. So we're trying to. Trying to make some changes.We've got the hatchery there at the bottom of cave. Ron has had a lot of water problems the last few years just with algae blooms and things like that. So the, the fish health has been bad, and they're.They're going to change some of that up and grow some muskies in a different facility that has a little bit better water situation to help us with our stocking.So, you know, none of that would have been possible without multiple tourism boards noticing how many people were coming through their city and renting airbnbs and buying fuel and hauling their rafts and jet boats and stuff. Like, people immediately understood, like, man, there's a lot of people coming for this, you know, so it was. It's been a huge, huge help.And we're only going to continue to hopefully raise more and more money to, you know, keep our conservation good for the muskies.

Marvin Cash00:52:39

Very, very neat. And so folks wanted to get more information for February of 2026. Where should they go?

Dave Huff00:52:45

You can go to The Kentucky River Muskie Classic. Instagram or Facebook. We don't currently have a website but it's managed all through social media. It's been. Been great. Easy to get a hold of us.Super small group.So anybody needs any information, you know, obviously the Instagram or, or Facebook page and then obviously you can reach out to the Wolf Rod co page too and we can point you in the right direction on that. It's just, yeah, I mean it's just a really cool, it's such a cool river system with you know, I was super, I was super hard on myself.You know, the musky zinc guys were wanting to do it earlier and you know, I was super worried about, you know, affecting the fishery and then I, we kind of sat down and we're just like, man, there's like over 500 miles of fishable water. Like it's going to be like the fisheries not going to be bothered by, you know, 40, 40 boats showing up to fish for two days, you know, so.And it, it's been great. It's, it really has been great. It's, it's a beautiful river system. The Kentucky river drainage is, you know, it's, it's huge. There's so many tribs.There's three main rivers that flow into one big river and it's just, there's just a lot of water and it's all filled with fish. So yeah, definitely look for sign ups soon. It's coming around the corner.I guess we'll, we'll start, we'll start getting registrations out about six months before the event and it's going to fill up. Filled up last year.So I'd imagine it's going to fill up again and then you know, one of the favorites from all the people that come there, Black Barn Barbecue. Local, local barbecue place. They do our, they do our food every year and they do it upright.They smoke chicken wings and gouda Mac and cheese and cornbread and brisket. The whole deal. We, we do it upright Kentucky style. So yeah, better get a team, get a team figured out.Three man teams, two man teams, whatever you want to do. And get signed up when you see that registration pop up. Because it won't, it won't take long to fill up. Yeah.

Marvin Cash00:55:12

Well, there you go. And so where can folks find you on the show circuit in 20, 26?

Dave Huff00:55:17

Oh man. So we're going to try to hit a couple of the big fly fishing shows. I don't know exactly which ones yet. We're trying to be in Atlanta for sure.Denver's another one, but it's. I think it's gonna. It overlapped with the Trout Fest and the Guadalupe River Trout Fest last year down in New Braunfels, Texas.So we're still trying to figure out final calendar on that. We'll definitely be back in Toronto again at the Sportsman show. And then, man, I don't know. We did like nine shows this year.It was pretty much full bore from like January to the end of March. So we did. We're going to be at the Virginia Fly Fishing and Wine Festival. That's in Doswell, Virginia. That'll be the first one we're at.And then we typically, we always do the Kentucky and a fly fishing show that's just, that's just south of Louisville. That's more of a local show, but it's, it's usually on a weekend where then there's no other big shows going on.And then obviously Trout Fest, we did the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo up in Warren, Michigan last year, then the Toronto show and then we did the Maggie Valley Fly Fishing Festival this year as well. So that's our second year doing that.So probably honestly at this point we're going to try to stick to all of the shows that we have been doing and then add on. So just going to try to keep growing it and letting people tell people about our product, man, getting it in people's hands.Hopefully we can get a decent booth at a couple of these bigger shows. We are even talking about potentially trying to go to ICAST this year or next year. Just, you know, get in front of more of the industry, so to speak.

Marvin Cash00:57:19

Got it. And before I let you go tonight, Dave, is there anything else you'd like to share with our listeners?

Dave Huff00:57:24

Man, I just, you know, we're, we're here for the long haul. I. It's, it's, it's a, it's a definitely a cutthroat world. You know, the industry as a whole is just, it's, it's always changing.But I think that, you know, if you have an opportunity to, to get a hold of one of our rods, test it out and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with, with its performance and just keep an eye on our, on our website.Another thing, you know, we're working on, I told you briefly touched base that we're working on some new marketing stuff and been trying to film some YouTube stuff. So we do have a YouTube channel. It doesn't have a lot of stuff on it now, but we're going to start, we're going to have some teasers out there soon.We're doing a, we're doing a new series on YouTube called the Wolf Pack Series.So it's essentially just a series of YouTube episodes where I travel around the country and meet fly shops that carry our products or fish with guide companies that fish our stuff on their boats. And yeah, it's going to be real, professionally done.Got some great film folks helping along the way with, you know, way more expensive stuff than I even know anything about. But let, let them capture all the stuff.I'm just gonna, you know, do my thing which is talk to the shops and introduce people and do some fishing and hopefully catch some fish. But yeah, look for the Wolf Pack series. We've got some, got some cool stuff on this on the schedule.We'll be up in Canada doing some filming with some of the folks that I've met over the years.And yeah, should be a cool series and hopefully another avenue for folks to learn more about us as a brand and more about how, how our, you know, what our vibes are and what kind of people we are.

Marvin Cash00:59:29

So yeah, and I'll drop a link to your YouTube channel in the show notes.And are there other places that folks should go to follow Wolf Rodco, get updates on the Kentucky River Muskie Classic and just generally follow your adventures on the water?

Dave Huff00:59:42

Yeah, man, the Wolf Rod Company, Instagram and Facebook, definitely Instagram's, we're a little heavier on that. It's just a lot easier for us to manage as a small company. And then the Kentucky River Muskie Classic, Instagram as well.But yeah, definitely the website wolf rodco.com has all of our stuff. Got some cool hats. Keep, keep an eye out for some, some new rods popping up down the road.And then I guess the only other thing I would ask is if anyone is, you know, a shop owner or you know, even guides.If you're interested in learning more about what we have to offer and what you know, we've got some great dealer pricing, super competitive pricing and our warranties second to none. So you're interested in getting us in your shop, hit me up Wolf radco at gmail.Be happy to hear more from you and send you a little bit more info on us.

Marvin Cash01:00:52

Well, there you go. Well, Dave, I really appreciate you taking some time out of your evening to talk with me.

Dave Huff01:00:56

All right, man, I appreciate it.

Marvin Cash01:00:58

Take care.

Dave Huff01:00:59

Thanks.

Marvin Cash01:01:00

Well, folks, we hope you enjoyed the interview as much as we enjoyed bringing it to you. Remember, links to all this episode's sponsors are in the show notes. Check them out. Tight lines, everybody.